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gouges (Read 1,218 times)
 
Tony Wheeler
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gouges
Feb 15th, 2006 at 6:46am
 
I was given some HSS and want to make a bowl and spindle gouges but so not know what angles to make the grinds at.  I am buliding a grinding jig.  Also I am going to have to weld tangs onto the HSS.  Hass anyone had any exoerence with this.  I am worried that welding a tang will just break because of being brittle from the heat.  Even if I pre heat the steel and then let it cool several day in flour.  Any Help is  appericated.
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Keith_Bundy
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Re: gouges
Reply #1 - Feb 15th, 2006 at 1:00pm
 
Hi - First, if they are long enough just glue them into a handle. I don't weld so I can't help on that part.  A good starting place for spindle gouge angles would be about 30 - 40 degrees. For bowl gouges you could go anywhere from about 40 - 70 degrees. It seems 60 - 65 degrees is popular for fairly long side ground gouges. 40 degrees seems to be used alot with the shorter side grind. If you get steeper the 60 - 65 degrees I'd use the more traditional grind with the upper portion ground back just a little. I haven't studied tools or grinds, this is just based on some tools I've seen and some grinds I've tried. Good luck and let us know how things turn out.
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junior
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Re: gouges
Reply #2 - Feb 15th, 2006 at 5:17pm
 
there is a chart that shows the angles, i have it in a book, but i am sure it is online somewhere, maybe the AAW site, or maybe even here..


And honestly, I am new to turning (less than a year) but i don't think i would use any tool that was welded, not for any serious work anyway, especially a bowl gouge. 


Looking at my spindle and bowl gouges, it seems you would need to start with round stock, and cut a channel in it, according to what you are making, then grind a cutting edge on it.

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Gil Jones
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Re: gouges
Reply #3 - Feb 15th, 2006 at 5:42pm
 
Here you can find pictures of many different gouge grinds.
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boxxmaker
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Re: gouges
Reply #4 - Feb 15th, 2006 at 6:03pm
 
As a new turner I have been doing a great deal of research on tools and this was truly the most informative set of pic's that I have seen.Thanks for the site info.
Ken
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Tony Wheeler
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Re: gouges
Reply #5 - Feb 15th, 2006 at 10:25pm
 
Keith thanks for the angles, Gil thanks for the links the pictures with Keith's angles and what angles on the wood central links will help a lot.  As far as the welding I had better do so more research on that. I have been a welder all my life bad have never had a cause to weld any tool steel.  So if it is possible to welder with a degree of success I can do if possible.  I will check on the possibably of welding and let you all know. Since I have found eariler posts  before I  got stated that questioned the same.  Thanks to all again.  Tony
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Gil Jones
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Re: gouges
Reply #6 - Feb 16th, 2006 at 2:37pm
 
Check out this site, it has plenty to tell about steels.
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Look under "General Information", "CPM Welding Guidelines".
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« Last Edit: Feb 16th, 2006 at 2:40pm by N/A »  
 
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Tony Wheeler
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Re: gouges
Reply #7 - Feb 17th, 2006 at 9:54am
 
Thanks alot Gil this is very helpful.  I will go ahead and weld a tang onto the tools now with the info fronm your link. It will require a little guessing now since my temp stick only go to 800 and the way I read the info is to preheat to a 1000.  Temp stick is a chalk (cayron) material that marks on metal until it is applied to the heat range .  I have 500, 600, 700 and 800 sticks. Then is will post heat and bury the tool in flour to control the cooling.  I will do a scraper first since it should have the least amount of force applied to it  I think.  tony
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Ken Grunke
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Re: gouges
Reply #8 - Feb 17th, 2006 at 10:56am
 
The safest way is to have a solid mechanical connection of the HSS pieces
in a handle, I'd be nervous about a weld even if I were a skilled welder.
So if you were starting with a 1/2" shaft of HSS for example, then drill a 1/2" hole in the end of a 3/4", 7/8", or 1" shaft and weld the HHS into that--it would make a great handle if about 18" long and with foam grips on it. Actually, you could just epoxy it in.
And the weldng heat might be enough to draw the temper from the HSS, although it's supposed to be able to withstand red heat before that happens.
I've heard some scary stories in various forums about tools snapping on a bad catch, and these were all solid steel, not welded even. Just don't want you to get hurt!
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Tony Wheeler
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Re: gouges
Reply #9 - Feb 17th, 2006 at 11:30am
 
Ken thanks for your thoughts and you might be right .  The only reason for welding in the first place was to have ability to attach to a handle.  The though of expoy to a handle never came to mind eventhough you talked about it in your earlier post.  The pieces I have are in 6 to 8 in pieces.  The thought about a catch is the only reason I haven't welded so far.  As far as the welding goes the place that a break would occur would be at the weld if it was to break.  This is usally caused by imbrittlement at the weld area.  This is caused without proper pre heat, the sudden large amount of heat causing the carbons to scatter away from the point of heat and then without a long period of cooling cycle the carbons return in clusters instead of the equal spaciong that they started at.  I say all of this so that others reading this post don't think that by pre and post heating anyone can weld tool steel, and without speical welding rod for the job.   So I think since I am so new at this turning and catchs are real regular with me I will use your ideas for now.  Thanks again Tony
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