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Josh, from St. Louis and Oshkosh, Wisconsin. (Read 1,761 times)
 
Josh Cain
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Josh, from St. Louis and Oshkosh, Wisconsin.
Mar 3rd, 2010 at 10:14am
 
Hello everyone,   
My name is Josh Cain I'm 34yrs young -and I am the guy with the lathe problem.   Brenden found me on YouTube where I posted some videos for Woodstock INT to see and hopefully replace.   The lathe was given new to me as a gift from a friend.   I've always wanted one since the 7th grade when I got to try one.   The lathe videos can be found on Brenden's post under tool talk.

I am from WI but I live in St. Louis.   Tools are very important to me as I used to make my living as an automotive tech in Oshkosh.  (I like Snap-On for hand tools) Now I live in St. Louis and I am a displaced captain for a small airline based here.   I say displaced because I'm flying as a 1st officer due to the economy.

My father is a very accomplished woodworker back home in Oshkosh, however he is not a woodturner.   Because he is a resource I have a small advantage using his tools and hanging around learning & working with him.   I'm excited to post pictures of my first turnings, they just happen to be segmented turnings that I gave away for Christmas.   They are just Ok - I would do them differently now but maybe some of you will be impressed because they are my 1st, I've only had my lathe since late Oct. 2009

I am mostly interested in segmenting,  But I will try everything.   About a month ago I bought Malcolm Tibbotts Book and all 3 of his DVDs and I'm itching to get going on more detailed turnings.   I have to use my dad for certain tools right now- Table saw, plainer, jointer, and widebelt.   My moble shop includes a Rikon bandsaw, Milwaukee 12" sliding miter saw, Shop Fox 16x42 lathe (I'm looking to upgrade it to something nicer.) Porter Cable router, Porter Cable 4x24 belt sander, Delta 12" disc sander and many more Milwaukee small power tools.   I also made my own really cool clamp rack that cuts glueing trouble down.   I've recently discovered Robert Sorby's tools & I like them very much.   I use A Super Nova 2 -four jaw chuck on my lathe with a wood river tail stock live center.    Stihl 20" Chain saw for harvesting my own lumber, -wich is still drying.

Well thats it for now. I'm excited to be here -It may take me longer to reply sometimes because I may be out on a trip, & because my computer crashed about 2 months back & I would rather invest in tools right now, I'm not excited to buy another computer. I use a friends computer for now.   Oh -Politically & economically I'm a conservative Smiley  I just had to throw that in!


Best to everyone & I can't wait to chat.
Josh

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« Last Edit: Mar 3rd, 2010 at 11:21am by Josh Cain »  
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Re: Josh, from St. Louis and Oshkosh, Wisconsin.
Reply #1 - Mar 3rd, 2010 at 11:30am
 
1st turnings.
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« Last Edit: Mar 3rd, 2010 at 11:30am by Josh Cain »  
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Re: Josh, from St. Louis and Oshkosh, Wisconsin.
Reply #2 - Mar 3rd, 2010 at 11:37am
 
Welcome Josh, we're glad to have ya, if you have questions, fire away, someone will surely have an answer and some of em will be correct. We also like photos, so when you get ready to post some click on the link up top to the Gallery and you'll have to register, its different soft wear from the form and most of us use the same name as we did to register here. Theirs a 75kb file size limit on all photos so you may have to re-size em to get em to upload.
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Re: Josh, from St. Louis and Oshkosh, Wisconsin.
Reply #3 - Mar 3rd, 2010 at 11:43am
 
Mike Baber wrote on Mar 3rd, 2010 at 11:37am:
Welcome Josh, we're glad to have ya, if you have questions, fire away, someone will surely have an answer and some of em will be correct. We also like photos, so when you get ready to post some click on the link up top to the Gallery and you'll have to register, its different soft wear from the form and most of us use the same name as we did to register here. Theirs a 75kb file size limit on all photos so you may have to re-size em to get em to upload.


Thanks!  I just posted one & hopefully everyone else can see it too.   It was a challenge Cheesy
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Re: Josh, from St. Louis and Oshkosh, Wisconsin.
Reply #4 - Mar 3rd, 2010 at 11:46am
 
Hi Josh,

And welcome.  There is a lot of similarity in how we both ended up here because I was dragged, kicking and screaming, from YouTube by Bert last year but soon this became my go-to site every time I sat at the computer.

About your lathe.  Whatever the quality, compared to other more expensive lathes, it should still be fit for purpose which your's obviously isn't right now so, unless you get a simple fix, I would pack it up and bring it back.  It is reasonable for you to ask for a replacement but maybe, if you were willing, the offer to buy a different, more expensive, lathe would sweeten the situation.  There are a lot of good lathes out there for reasonable money so you wouldn't be out a fortune.

Your segmented pieces are a super start.  I haven't done any yet and probably won't for a long time but I hope my first looks like yours because then I would be well pleased.

I look forward to seeing more work and hope you get this lathe problem sorted.

Brendan
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Re: Josh, from St. Louis and Oshkosh, Wisconsin.
Reply #5 - Mar 3rd, 2010 at 11:58am
 
Hey Brendan,  Thanks for the compliment!   & I'm glad you brought me to this site.   

I'm almost afraid to call them back - I sent them the links to the videos.  I guess I'm just waiting.   I would love a nicer lathe, but at the same time I think the tolerances should be better on this one.   & I don't want to make the thoughtful person who got it for me feel bad.

The other thing is-  this is the nicest lathe Shop Fox sells...   So I don't know if it can be sweetened at all.   Maybe if I offer to get one from a supplier of theirs?  Not sure if that will work.   I called them the 1st week I had it set up and just yesterday & they will not stand behind it - He (Andrew at Woodstock) said you get what you pay for.   Undecided
Josh

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Re: Josh, from St. Louis and Oshkosh, Wisconsin.
Reply #6 - Mar 3rd, 2010 at 12:04pm
 
"...you get what you pay for"

I there anything in the literature on the lathe to tell you the centres don't line up?  If the person who bought this lathe was aware of that they wouldn't have bought it.
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Re: Josh, from St. Louis and Oshkosh, Wisconsin.
Reply #7 - Mar 3rd, 2010 at 12:16pm
 
Hi Josh and welcome to WR and to St Louis too. I’m only a few miles from you, out in Eureka. I watched your vid and of course read your post. I get the feeling that you are unable to return/exchange the lathe and are stuck with what you have. I’ll throw in my $.02 here in an effort to help out.
     This being your first lathe and you being new to turning I’m going to proceed as if you just put it together and plugged it in. You have more than one problem here with alignment  and need to tackle each one separately. Firstly dig out a level. A lathe bed will flex and throw everything out of alignment. Level your lathe front to back and end to end. Spend some time getting it perfect. If it is sitting on carpet you will need to put some largish plywood squares under the leveling feet as the lathe will not sit solid on the carpet. You will be amazed how much the lathe bed will twist and throw your points off if out of alignment so spend some time and get this right.
     You have a ton slop in your lathe and that needs to be minimized. Lets get the easiest first. The vertical alignment or height of the points. Shims are the only way  I can see of  compensating in your situation. Get a roll of  adhesive backed foil tape. You will find it in the heating duct work aisle in Home Depot or Lowes. Cut a few narrow strips and start sticking them to the bottom of your tailstock to raise it. If you have a lot of movement when you twist the tailstock you may need a strip or two on the interior portion of the tailstock guides that ride the bed ways. Just enough to slow down the flex. If more than 4 or so strips of tape are required at each side of the tail stock bed you might be better off epoxying on 2 strips of thin metal shim stock (think auto parts store for a source) as the tailstock movement might tear the tape away. This should get your tailstock to a repeatable position. Now on to the other end.
     I have a jet 1442 and a Nova DVR. Both have swiveling heads and neither will return to a perfect alignment after swiveling the head. All you can really do is play with it until you find the position that gets you acceptable alignment. Swivel the head and decide if the alignment is better pushing the head away from you till it hits the stop or pulling toward you still it hits the stop. Now when you return from the swivel position either push or pull before locking in place. I think I would suggest here just forgetting about the swivel option and getting your alignment the way you want it, lock your head down at the end of the lathe and leave it there.
     Hope this gets you on the road to a decent alignment. I’m sure I have forgotten several points here but I know others will add to this. Also I hope they will just exchange this machine as it is no where near right even for a low end lathe…Bill…
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Re: Josh, from St. Louis and Oshkosh, Wisconsin.
Reply #8 - Mar 3rd, 2010 at 12:20pm
 
Guess you posted while I was typing. Beautiful pieces you posted. Mighty impressive work especially considering the machinery problems you are fighting...Bill..
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Re: Josh, from St. Louis and Oshkosh, Wisconsin.
Reply #9 - Mar 3rd, 2010 at 12:21pm
 
Welcome Josh,
I don't know what to tell you about your lathe, but if it were mine I'd sure raise hell with both the retailer and the manufacturer, and based on the retailer's response to your complaint, I'd certainly remove them from my "places to shop" list!

As far as your turning, you're off to an excellent start, and you won't go wrong with Malcom's book and DVDs. He does subperb work! I would also recommend two DVDs by Curt Theobald. He covers the basics very well, and supplies instructions for a sanding sled to go with your disk sander. I find it a must for very precise final shaping of segments & paterns.

Good luck!
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Re: Josh, from St. Louis and Oshkosh, Wisconsin.
Reply #10 - Mar 3rd, 2010 at 12:36pm
 
Bill Bolen wrote on Mar 3rd, 2010 at 12:20pm:
Guess you posted while I was typing. Beautiful pieces you posted. Mighty impressive work especially considering the machinery problems you are fighting...Bill..


Thank You.    More to come if I can get this lathe problem solved, right now I'm trapped into doing just small pieces. smiley=dankk2.gif
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Re: Josh, from St. Louis and Oshkosh, Wisconsin.
Reply #11 - Mar 3rd, 2010 at 12:38pm
 
Jim Killen wrote on Mar 3rd, 2010 at 12:21pm:
Welcome Josh,
I don't know what to tell you about your lathe, but if it were mine I'd sure raise hell with both the retailer and the manufacturer, and based on the retailer's response to your complaint, I'd certainly remove them from my "places to shop" list!

As far as your turning, you're off to an excellent start, and you won't go wrong with Malcom's book and DVDs. He does subperb work! I would also recommend two DVDs by Curt Theobald. He covers the basics very well, and supplies instructions for a sanding sled to go with your disk sander. I find it a must for very precise final shaping of segments & paterns.

Good luck!


I will check them out right away!   Thank you for that!
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Re: Josh, from St. Louis and Oshkosh, Wisconsin.
Reply #12 - Mar 3rd, 2010 at 12:50pm
 
Bill Bolen wrote on Mar 3rd, 2010 at 12:16pm:
Hi Josh and welcome to WR and to St Louis too. I’m only a few miles from you, out in Eureka. I watched your vid and of course read your post. I get the feeling that you are unable to return/exchange the lathe and are stuck with what you have. I’ll throw in my $.02 here in an effort to help out.
     This being your first lathe and you being new to turning I’m going to proceed as if you just put it together and plugged it in. You have more than one problem here with alignment  and need to tackle each one separately. Firstly dig out a level. A lathe bed will flex and throw everything out of alignment. Level your lathe front to back and end to end. Spend some time getting it perfect. If it is sitting on carpet you will need to put some largish plywood squares under the leveling feet as the lathe will not sit solid on the carpet. You will be amazed how much the lathe bed will twist and throw your points off if out of alignment so spend some time and get this right.
     You have a ton slop in your lathe and that needs to be minimized. Lets get the easiest first. The vertical alignment or height of the points. Shims are the only way  I can see of  compensating in your situation. Get a roll of  adhesive backed foil tape. You will find it in the heating duct work aisle in Home Depot or Lowes. Cut a few narrow strips and start sticking them to the bottom of your tailstock to raise it. If you have a lot of movement when you twist the tailstock you may need a strip or two on the interior portion of the tailstock guides that ride the bed ways. Just enough to slow down the flex. If more than 4 or so strips of tape are required at each side of the tail stock bed you might be better off epoxying on 2 strips of thin metal shim stock (think auto parts store for a source) as the tailstock movement might tear the tape away. This should get your tailstock to a repeatable position. Now on to the other end.
     I have a jet 1442 and a Nova DVR. Both have swiveling heads and neither will return to a perfect alignment after swiveling the head. All you can really do is play with it until you find the position that gets you acceptable alignment. Swivel the head and decide if the alignment is better pushing the head away from you till it hits the stop or pulling toward you still it hits the stop. Now when you return from the swivel position either push or pull before locking in place. I think I would suggest here just forgetting about the swivel option and getting your alignment the way you want it, lock your head down at the end of the lathe and leave it there.
     Hope this gets you on the road to a decent alignment. I’m sure I have forgotten several points here but I know others will add to this. Also I hope they will just exchange this machine as it is no where near right even for a low end lathe…Bill…



Hi Bill!   Do you belong to a club?  Thank you for your help  smiley=dankk2.gif  I am going to break away here shortly & go to Home depot on Manchester Rd. to get some JB weld.  I may use your idea but on the inside of the joint on the underside of the headstock.   I'd still like the company to stand behind this issue though.

I actually had the lathe on a concrete floor when I 1st set it up.   The reason it is on carpet now is because I just finished the other room with a new tile floor and a finished basement room which is nicer than the room with the carpet.   I'll try some 3/4 MDF as I have that around - then recheck for level.  Some of the play is in the lock & keyway for the swivel on the headstock, the other little movement is between the bed ways and the dovetail joint on the headstock.

Thanks for the great advice!

Josh
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Re: Josh, from St. Louis and Oshkosh, Wisconsin.
Reply #13 - Mar 3rd, 2010 at 12:52pm
 
Brendan McAreavy wrote on Mar 3rd, 2010 at 12:04pm:
"...you get what you pay for"

I there anything in the literature on the lathe to tell you the centres don't line up?  If the person who bought this lathe was aware of that they wouldn't have bought it.



I agree!
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Re: Josh, from St. Louis and Oshkosh, Wisconsin.
Reply #14 - Mar 3rd, 2010 at 2:31pm
 
welcome Josh. smiley=beer.gif smiley=beer.gif

while it is true that "you get what you pay for", it is also true that if a business does not stand behind it's products, it won't be in business very long.  if it is possible, take the lathe back to the store it was purchased from and show them the slop.  if needed, make some loud noise to attract other customers to come over to see what is going on.  they won't like what is being said by the store, and will leave without buying.  word will spread, and the business could go under.

in the mean time, have fun.
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Re: Josh, from St. Louis and Oshkosh, Wisconsin.
Reply #15 - Mar 3rd, 2010 at 3:12pm
 
Well good news and bad news......   

The good news is Woodstock INT is going to stand behind their product and take it back.   

The BAD news...   I'm going to be without a lathe for a little while.   I have 1500.00  to put towards a new lathe but I think I want to go the powermatic route, or something similar.   20" swing would be great.   I don't need a 43" bed -  I'd be happy with a 32" bed like the powermatic.

Any Ideas?   It may be a while -  I need to save money, and it will cut into my Saw Stop purchase.

Josh
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Re: Josh, from St. Louis and Oshkosh, Wisconsin.
Reply #16 - Mar 4th, 2010 at 11:41am
 
Welcome, Josh, Happy Turning
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Re: Josh, from St. Louis and Oshkosh, Wisconsin.
Reply #17 - Mar 5th, 2010 at 2:49pm
 
Welcome Josh,

Sorry but your Lathe problem just confused me totally  Undecided, I wouldn't have a clue what to do with it Undecided. Good job that on WR. there is a lot of help available. smiley=thumbsup.gif

Your turnings look fantastic, first ones or not. Great job. smiley=thumbsup.gif smiley=thumbsup.gif
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Re: Josh, from St. Louis and Oshkosh, Wisconsin.
Reply #18 - Mar 7th, 2010 at 5:33pm
 
look at the nova  1624 lathe
i have one. it replaced a jet 1442 that's another story
if you do get a new lathe  stay away from a reeves drive unit because they are very high maintenance lathes
also buy what you can afford but be care full of what you get 
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just making toothpicks
 
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Re: Josh, from St. Louis and Oshkosh, Wisconsin.
Reply #19 - Mar 13th, 2010 at 6:29pm
 
Just ordered my new Powermatic from Woodcraft St. Louis today.   I put 1,000 on it and told him to take his time,  -this way I can slowly pay for it...   Now the painful waiting.

I'm excited! Smiley
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