Woodturner's Resource
Woodturner's Resource  
  • Featured Artist    • Websites   Support Wr
Tutorials, Projects & Tips   • Event Calendar   • Tool and Book Store
  Home Page Forum HelpSearch Map TPT Resources LoginRegister
 
Page Index Toggle Pages: 1
Send Topic Print
Segmenting woes (Read 1,023 times)
 
Jack Hunsucker
WR Devotee
*****
Offline


I am a part of all that
I have met.

Posts: 369

Lawton, Oklahoma, Oklahoma, USA
Lawton, Oklahoma
Oklahoma
USA

Gender: male
Segmenting woes
Mar 17th, 2013 at 9:29am
 
I made an attempt at trying my first segmented bowl yesterday. I used Ron Sardo's segmenting calculater, and tried to be as careful as possible with the angles and cuts, but never achieved a perfect circle. Any other techniques to making cuts that may help? Smiley
Back to top
  

Papajack
http://www.facebook.com/papajack70?ref=profile  
IP Logged
 
Register To Remove Ads
Guy Bratt
WR Patron
******
Offline


WR Rocks!

Posts: 939

Richmond, Michigan, USA
Richmond
Michigan
USA

Gender: male

Robust American Beauty
Rikon 70-100
Re: Segmenting woes
Reply #1 - Mar 17th, 2013 at 10:01am
 
Hi Jack      I haven't used Ron's calculator.  How ever I imagine you end up with number of segments divided into 360.   360-12=30  segments cut at 15* each side.  It's important to NOT use the degree indicators on your equipment.  For segmenting this is not close enough.  Get ahold of a protractor with a leg similar to a T square.  Make a template to match the angle your wanting. Cut segments out of scrap and adjust the angles untill you get a good circle. Clamp your gear in place and go from there.  Save a template of the angle so you can reset on the next project.

I hope this is clear enough and that it helps.         Guy
Back to top
  

Old, Fat,n Ugly...I shed 100 pounds this year.  Still old.  Still ugly. But what can you do at this age?
You know? If you knew me you'd see my avatar and I really look a lot alike.
 
IP Logged
 
Larry Matchett
WR Supporter
*****
Offline


Be One with your Tool!

Posts: 1,588

Gulf Coast, Mississippi, Mississippi, USA
Gulf Coast, Mississippi
Mississippi
USA

Gender: male
Re: Segmenting woes
Reply #2 - Mar 17th, 2013 at 10:02am
 
Length and angle are critical.  I have found that using a jig, ie crosscut sled on my table saw worked great.  A small error in either angle or length is greatly magnified when making a circle.  The greater the number of segments the greater the chance for error.
Back to top
  
WWW  
IP Logged
 
Ed Weber
WR Global Moderator
WR Patron
*****
Offline



Posts: 4,688

Wilton, California, USA
Wilton
California
USA

Gender: male

JET 1642
Grizzly G0584
Re: Segmenting woes
Reply #3 - Mar 17th, 2013 at 10:34am
 
An easy  method that was mentioned recently, is to work in stages.
Example, if you are making an 8 segment ring, cut the best you can, then glue the segments up on pairs. Once dry check for square. Anyone should be able to cut or sand to a 90 degree angle.
Next glue up the segments into pairs to get halves, you should now have two half rings. Again, once dry sand or cut until both ends of the ring are in alignment or straight. This might be a good place to use some sandpaper on a known flat surface like a tablesaw top or jointer bed. Once both sides are straight flat and evev, glue them together to get a ring. during this process you should be aware of what type of adjustments you need to make for the next project.
Good luck
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
Ron Sardo
WR Administrator
WR Patron
*****
Offline


Chief cook and bottle
washer

Posts: 9,263

Drums, Pennsylvania, USA
Drums
Pennsylvania
USA


PM 3520
Re: Segmenting woes
Reply #4 - Mar 17th, 2013 at 11:03am
 
I always glue enough segments to make a 1/4 circle then I true up to 90°. Next I glue two quarters to make a half circle then true up both halves to 180°.

Edit in:
(I think I just said the same thing as Ed,)
Back to top
« Last Edit: Mar 17th, 2013 at 11:06am by Ron Sardo »  

Multimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!!  You need to Login or Register
WWW  
IP Logged
 
Jack Hunsucker
WR Devotee
*****
Offline


I am a part of all that
I have met.

Posts: 369

Lawton, Oklahoma, Oklahoma, USA
Lawton, Oklahoma
Oklahoma
USA

Gender: male
Re: Segmenting woes
Reply #5 - Mar 17th, 2013 at 1:08pm
 
Thanks, I think that might solve my problems. I don't have a table saw, but I use a miter saw. Glueing up segments into segments makes perfect sense. Smiley
Back to top
  

Papajack
http://www.facebook.com/papajack70?ref=profile  
IP Logged
 
Walt
WR Patron
******
Offline


WR Rocks!

Posts: 1,988

Hanford, California, USA
Hanford
California
USA

Gender: male

PM 3520A
Re: Segmenting woes
Reply #6 - Mar 17th, 2013 at 1:21pm
 
I use a sled dedicated to cutting a spefic angle on my table saw.  I also have sanding jigs to refine the edge.  I checking angles at every station, clearing saw dust on every cut and at the disc sander.  I will glue up the entire ring at once but use dowels at 0 and 180*  so I get two halves.  This is due to what I can't compensate for in the glue up.  After 2-3 hours in the band clamp I'll true up the two halves and glue those up.  The big thing is to have great joints, not sanding after cutting can make for a bad looking joint that holds more glue than others and stand out. 

Glueing up pairs and quads is a good way to start, refining angles as you go.  It tedious and demanding which requires patience.  You can't rush or miss a step or your joints will look like it.  So give yourself a lot of time and it will pay off with a great looking project.
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
Ed Weber
WR Global Moderator
WR Patron
*****
Offline



Posts: 4,688

Wilton, California, USA
Wilton
California
USA

Gender: male

JET 1642
Grizzly G0584
Re: Segmenting woes
Reply #7 - Mar 17th, 2013 at 2:06pm
 
Walt wrote on Mar 17th, 2013 at 1:21pm:
The big thing is to have great joints, not sanding after cutting can make for a bad looking joint that holds more glue than others and stand out.

Glueing up pairs and quads is a good way to start, refining angles as you go.It tedious and demanding which requires patience.You can't rush or miss a step or your joints will look like it.So give yourself a lot of time and it will pay off with a great looking project. 


Walt is right on the money.
One of the main differences with segmenting and other types of fine woodworking, is that the is really no room for good enough, What I mean, is that any minor error will usually become quite obvious and in some situations cause joint failure.
In the segmenting corner of the vortex you really need good sharp blades, clean abrasives and proper alignment of all work stations if you want to have any chance of success. Segmenting can be tedious work but I think it's worth it.
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
Register To Remove Ads
steve rost
WR Devotee
*****
Offline


Jigaholic

Posts: 436

Mansfield, Texas, USA
Mansfield
Texas
USA

Gender: male
Re: Segmenting woes
Reply #8 - Mar 17th, 2013 at 6:41pm
 
I like what Walt has to say.  My method is very similar.  Ed is right, accuracy is essential.  Keep trying, I figure I invest a ratio of 30/1 (stock prep, assembly/ actually turning) on a simple ring.  A feature ring I am working on now will have a 100/1 ratio of time spent.  Patience Grasshopper!
Back to top
  

One measure of a great craftsman is how well he can hide his mistakes!
 
IP Logged
 
Page Index Toggle Pages: 1
Send Topic Print