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Glue, Glue, Glue, Glue, Glue..... Glue Glue! (Read 2,475 times)
 
Charlie Zapalac
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Re: Glue, Glue, Glue, Glue, Glue..... Glue Glue!
Reply #15 - Dec 3rd, 2013 at 11:01pm
 
"It is doubtful they well add any strength"

They will add strength by increasing the glue area.  That's one reason to use different joints besides simple butt joints.  Lap joints and other type joints greatly increase the gluing area.  As said, if glued correctly, the glue joint will be exponentially stronger than the wood.  Nails are only needed to hold things till the glue dries, so if you properly glue something, then shoot it full of nails like a machine gun, your just making the nail companies rich.
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Ed Weber
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Re: Glue, Glue, Glue, Glue, Glue..... Glue Glue!
Reply #16 - Dec 4th, 2013 at 10:18am
 
Just buy a new bottle of Titebond and be done with it.  Grin
As far as biscuits or dowels go, from your example, you don't need them.
When gluing long-grain to long-grain parallel, you don't need any mechanical assistance. If the boards get too long, if they have a bow/twist or are just difficult to join, then it's best to use biscuits or dowels for alignment.
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Jerry Aldini
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Re: Glue, Glue, Glue, Glue, Glue..... Glue Glue!
Reply #17 - Dec 4th, 2013 at 3:48pm
 
I would go with Titebond II or III depending on the color of wood.  III is darker, good for walnut and it also has a longer setup time. It is also completely waterproof.

Dowels or biscuits only for alignment if necessary, they add no strength to the joint and their impression can sometimes telecast through. 

Gorilla glue is one of the weakest glues out there and is messy to work with.  It stains your fingers and can not be washed off.  The staining remains on your fingers for several days. Wear latex gloves.  FWW did a review on glue strengths a few years back and polyurethane glues were the weakest  IIRC.
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Ed Weber
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Re: Glue, Glue, Glue, Glue, Glue..... Glue Glue!
Reply #18 - Dec 4th, 2013 at 5:04pm
 
Jerry Aldini wrote on Dec 4th, 2013 at 3:48pm:
Dowels or biscuits only for alignment if necessary, they add no strength to the joint

Lets try to keep our facts straight.
Adding to what Charlie Z. said.
A dowel is nothing more than a round floating tenon.
A biscuit is no more than a football shaped floating tenon.
A floating tenon has a few purposes which are
1.STRENGTH, a biscuit or dowel will add strength to an otherwise weak butt joint. Adding one of these devices gives you a mechanical advantage beyond the glue alone, just like a nail or screw.
2. Alignment, Dowels and biscuits are nothing more than a mechanical fastener for aligning and constructing furniture and other wood works. See above
3. Glue Area. It’s true that adding a Biscuit or dowel will add an extra amount of gluing area and thereby making the joint stronger, although his amount of area gained is minimal.
If you want a stronger connection, start out with a stronger joint that gives you a mechanical advantage while also increasing the glue area.
.
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Jerry Aldini
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Re: Glue, Glue, Glue, Glue, Glue..... Glue Glue!
Reply #19 - Dec 4th, 2013 at 10:35pm
 
Ed,  I worked in a furniture shop, Furniture by Dovetail.  We had this same discussion in the shop over which was stronger....so we did a stress test on 2 panels, 1 that was glued up with biscuits, the other which was just properly jointed and glued.  Same glue, no biscuits.  The panel without the biscuits held out much longer and when it finally broke, the wood broke completely clear of the glue joint.  The one with the biscuits split right down the glue line.  It doesn't stand to reason, one would assume with dowels or biscuits,  there's more glue surface so it should be stronger but it's not true.  I'm a believer. 
Biscuits and loose tenons have their purpose though.  I own a Festool Domino and love it.  I use them when joining perpendicular boards in a carcass where end grain is involved.  But I never use them when edge joining boards for a panel glue up.
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