The Woodturning Forum - Woodturner's Resource - source for PEG in bulk quantities

Breck Whitworth

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source for PEG in bulk quantities
Oct 25^th, 2014 at 8:46am

Hi guys does anyone know a good source for buying Peg in bulk quantities. I found where I can get 10lbs for about $58. from rockler but If I want to fill the bottom of a 55gal. drum (not full of course) I believe I will need about 15-20 gal. Is it sold in solid/flaked form then mixed with something to make the liquid or can I just buy it in the liquid form. The 10lb threw me I was expecting gal. measurements instead of lbs. Thanks! Thumbs Up

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Al Wasser WR Addict Offline WR Rocks! Posts: 626 Pueblo West, CO Colorado USA Gender: Robust American Beauty	Re: source for PEG in bulk quantities Reply #1 - Oct 25^th, 2014 at 9:31am There is/was a book out on using PEG. I had it but have moved a few times since so didn't come up with it. As I recall there is a limit to the thickness of wood that can be treated. The book may also list some sources. I had the interest but never did any treating with PEG. The book would date to the early '70's.
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Tony Rozendaal WR Addict Offline WR Rocks! Posts: 990 East Troy, WI Wisconsin USA Gender: Robust AB Grizzly 12x20 Midi Lathe Delta 10x16 Mini Lathe	Re: source for PEG in bulk quantities Reply #2 - Oct 25^th, 2014 at 5:49pm MiraLax laxitive is a form of PEG... ...Not sure if it would work for treating wood, though.
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Al Wasser WR Addict Offline WR Rocks! Posts: 626 Pueblo West, CO Colorado USA Gender: Robust American Beauty	Re: source for PEG in bulk quantities Reply #3 - Oct 26^th, 2014 at 10:13am In this case, PEG stands for polyethylene glycol, but it is not the same formulation as antifreeze.
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Bob Hamilton

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Re: source for PEG in bulk quantities
Reply #4 - Oct 26^th, 2014 at 10:44am

Patrick Spielman wrote a book about treating green wood with PEG in the early 80's. The PEG is mixed with water and needs to be kept within a certain temperature range which is a higher than room temperature. I don't recall the specific temperatures or concentrations. I do remember that there were problems with getting some finishes to adhere to the treated wood.

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We used to use a liquid form of PEG as an additive to polyethylene in the place where I used to work. It reduced the tendency of the plastic jugs that were made from the plastic to develop static charges and attract dust and dirt while sitting on the store shelf. One unintended property of the liquid was that it had a bit of a bleaching effect and the plastic made with it as an additive was whiter than plastic that did not have the PEG in it. I once spilled a few drops on my work boot and it bleached the color out of the leather as well. I don't know how that would carry over to different concentrations and formulations of the stuff or how it would affect dark colored woods.

Take care
Bob

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Tim Hyatt

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Re: source for PEG in bulk quantities
Reply #5 - Oct 27^th, 2014 at 2:08pm

PEG has been used in Archeologic preservation of antiquities for many decades, and is the preservative of choice for wood and other items of vegetable fibers ... (there's even a regime for slowly saturating an item that has been submerged in water; must be done slowly but consistently to keep the item from drying out and warping....)

I know that the process is generally very involved when dealing with such things due to their fragility. My experience is fairly limited, amounting to the Dig-master handing me a pre-mixed bottle and instructing me to carefully apply it to the fragments of wood we were uncovering...

The results are hard to argue with, though the preserved pieces do have a decidedly "plastic" feel to them. From what I've read on using Cactus Juice, it seems like the procedures (and results) are fairly similar....

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« Last Edit: Oct 27^th, 2014 at 2:09pm by Tim Hyatt »

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Ken Vaughan

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Re: source for PEG in bulk quantities
Reply #6 - Oct 28^th, 2014 at 10:33pm

Tim Hyatt wrote on Oct 27^th, 2014 at 2:08pm:

PEG has been used in Archeologic preservation of antiquities for many decades, and is the preservative of choice for wood and other items of vegetable fibers ... (there's even a regime for slowly saturating an item that has been submerged in water; must be done slowly but consistently to keep the item from drying out and warping....)

I know that the process is generally very involved when dealing with such things due to their fragility. My experience is fairly limited, amounting to the Dig-master handing me a pre-mixed bottle and instructing me to carefully apply it to the fragments of wood we were uncovering...

The results are hard to argue with, though the preserved pieces do have a decidedly "plastic" feel to them. From what I've read on using Cactus Juice, it seems like the procedures (and results) are fairly similar....

The antiquities people are finding in the long term that PEG presents some serious problems with formation of sulfuric acids. It present a conundrum, because it does provide shorter term stabilization, but after quite a few years the problem appear.

Ancient ship in Sweden is where the experience was cited. The ship is an interesting read in how not to do things -- was built by two crews from two countries with different measurement systems, and had some executive decisions by a king that were not practical - -resulting in early sinking.

I can dig for the name if you wish -- not near the top of the head.

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Curtis Warstler Senior Member Offline WR Rocks! Posts: 354 Thornton Colorado USA Gender: JET 1236 Something Wicked this way comes...	Re: source for PEG in bulk quantities Reply #7 - Oct 29^th, 2014 at 12:37am Ken I would be intrested that sounds intresting
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Larry Matchett WR Addict Offline Be One with your Tool! Posts: 1,588 Gulf Coast, Mississippi Mississippi USA Gender:	Re: source for PEG in bulk quantities Reply #8 - Oct 29^th, 2014 at 5:44am VASA. A really interesting museum if you get a chance to go there. Museum was built around the ship after it was recovered.
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Ken Vaughan WR Addict Offline Still learning Posts: 3,685 Juneau Alaska USA Gender: Stubby 750 Jet 1014 vs Bonnie Klein Lathe	Re: source for PEG in bulk quantities Reply #9 - Oct 30^th, 2014 at 7:51am Thanks Larry -- The name would not pop out of memory --
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Grant Wilkinson WR Addict Offline Posts: 783 Ottawa Ontario Canada	Re: source for PEG in bulk quantities Reply #10 - Oct 30^th, 2014 at 3:29pm I believe that Polyall is a liquid form of PEG, but I may be mistaken. You can look on their site for more info. polyall.com
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Bob Hamilton

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Re: source for PEG in bulk quantities
Reply #11 - Oct 30^th, 2014 at 9:48pm

Hi, Grant:
Polyall 2000 is a very very thin two part polyurethane glue that is intended to soak in to rotted or punky wood and restore its structural strength. Any residue left on the surface foams as it cures just like other kinds of polyurethane glue. I don't think it would perform the same function as PEG which is intended to displace and replace the water in the wood cells so they don't collapse and distort as they dry.

Take care
Bob

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Ken Vaughan WR Addict Offline Still learning Posts: 3,685 Juneau Alaska USA Gender: Stubby 750 Jet 1014 vs Bonnie Klein Lathe	Re: source for PEG in bulk quantities Reply #12 - Oct 30^th, 2014 at 10:30pm Breck I messed with PEG once upon a time. It came in blocks with a waxy feel. Dissolved in water. Soaking was extended time. Wood felt waxy after drying.
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Walt Nollan WR Addict Offline WR Rocks! Posts: 2,002 Hanford California USA Gender: PM 3520A	Re: source for PEG in bulk quantities Reply #13 - Oct 31^st, 2014 at 12:22pm I went searching for an article I read years ago on using COSTCO laundry detergent for this same purpose. Its mix of chemicals made it perfect for stabilizing wood. Unfortunately I cant find it. No telling if the soap has the same make up as it did.
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Paul Gilbert Senior Member Offline Turned by Paul Posts: 433 Allen, TX Texas USA Gender: PM3520B	Re: source for PEG in bulk quantities Reply #14 - Oct 31^st, 2014 at 1:34pm Univar is a distributer for Dow chemicals. You must buy a 500 lb. drum, but the quoted price I got was $2.5224/lb. Dow's trade name for PEG 1000 is Carbowax Centry.
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