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How is this made? (Read 1,784 times)
 
Julian Roslanowski
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How is this made?
May 9th, 2016 at 5:05pm
 
Can someone explain how these triangle pieces are made?  Appears to me they are in the center of the segment.  Is this just a matter of cutting a channel on the router table?
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Ed Weber
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Re: How is this made?
Reply #1 - May 9th, 2016 at 7:14pm
 
Julian, As far as how this artist did it, I would only be guessing.
There are several ways this can be done and all of them are time consuming.(since there seems to be about 176 triangles)
Router table and or jig, table saw, even a mortising machine, it's up to your imagination.
Do you know who's piece this is?
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Julian Roslanowski
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Re: How is this made?
Reply #2 - May 9th, 2016 at 8:37pm
 
Ed, I found this on the internet.  I did not notice if there was a name.  A mortising machine; I like that suggestion.  That might be an easy solution.  Thanks.
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Ken Vaughan
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Re: How is this made?
Reply #3 - May 10th, 2016 at 3:05pm
 
Julian

You found an excellent example of precision.   The small triangles appear to be along a glueline.   The "notch" can be formed with saw, router bit, etc, and be filled and trued with a tablesaw.

I am impressed with the precision of placement of the inset triangle in the center of each segment on each layer to provide such a smooth spiral and unity of pattern.

You picked a nice piece to analyze.
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« Last Edit: May 10th, 2016 at 3:07pm by Ken Vaughan »  
 
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Re: How is this made?
Reply #4 - May 11th, 2016 at 10:32am
 
Precision in segmentation?  What will they think of nest!  We should be precise in every piece we make.  Any mis-alignment stands out and draws the eye to it. Every seam should have the offset or alignment.   At least that is what I strive for.
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Ed Weber
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Re: How is this made?
Reply #5 - May 11th, 2016 at 11:29am
 
Walt wrote on May 11th, 2016 at 10:32am:
Precision in segmentation?  What will they think of nest!

You owe me a keyboard  Grin

Walt wrote on May 11th, 2016 at 10:32am:
We should be precise in every piece we make.  Any mis-alignment stands out and draws the eye to it. Every seam should have the offset or alignment.   At least that is what I strive for.

And that's just crazy talk  Roll Eyes Grin
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Julian Roslanowski
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Re: How is this made?
Reply #6 - May 12th, 2016 at 8:43am
 
Last night I tried cutting some segmented pieces to see how easy or difficult this would be using a mortising machine.  It worked, but the set up can be very fussy.  This was more work than cutting triangle sections with the wedgie sled.  I can make a very similar looking design using the wedgie sled.
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Ed Weber
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Re: How is this made?
Reply #7 - May 12th, 2016 at 9:26am
 
Julian Roslanowski wrote on May 12th, 2016 at 8:43am:
Last night I tried cutting some segmented pieces to see how easy or difficult this would be using a mortising machine.  It worked, but the set up can be very fussy.

I'm not sure if you did it this way just for a test or this is how you intend to do it.
I would cut several mortises in a long piece of stock and then cut the segments free, aligning the  center as necessary.

Julian Roslanowski wrote on May 12th, 2016 at 8:43am:
This was more work than cutting triangle sections with the wedgie sled.  I can make a very similar looking design using the wedgie sled.

Can you elaborate of show photos?
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Julian Roslanowski
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Re: How is this made?
Reply #8 - May 12th, 2016 at 11:49am
 
This was just a test on some extra segments I had laying around.  This photo is another test ring I made some time ago with the wedgie sled.  The spacing between the triangles can be adjusted by changing the length of the segments.
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Re: How is this made?
Reply #9 - May 12th, 2016 at 12:17pm
 
If I was going to make this, I would probably go about it like this.
Find some wide stock, enough to rip 2 or 3 segment thick strips from.
First I would use the table saw to cut the 90 degree V-notch in the segments.
I would install a dado stack and angle to 45 degrees.
I feel a table saw would give me less tear out than a router bit since I'm cutting cross grain.
After all the notches are cut, I would rip the wider stock to proper size,
Then, using what ever method you like cut the segments from the notched strips.
You can use the V-notch as a stop or detent to register each segment. This will ensure each notch within each segment is uniform (centered).
Hope that makes sense
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Re: How is this made?
Reply #10 - May 12th, 2016 at 12:31pm
 
I'ld use the wedgie sled.  This is one of the benefits that this sled offers, with accuracy.  Any other method has more set-up which equates to more potential for errors.
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Re: How is this made?
Reply #11 - May 12th, 2016 at 12:40pm
 
Walt wrote on May 12th, 2016 at 12:31pm:
I'ld use the wedgie sled.


For what part of the process?
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Re: How is this made?
Reply #12 - May 12th, 2016 at 1:24pm
 
It looks like the light pieces are basically staves. Segments cut with compound miter. The angle for the triangles then would seem to be the miter angle of the stave. Not 100% sure of this but that what it looks like to me.
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Ed Weber
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Re: How is this made?
Reply #13 - May 12th, 2016 at 1:40pm
 
Bruce Kamp wrote on May 12th, 2016 at 1:24pm:
It looks like the light pieces are basically staves.


You think we're looking at end-grain on those segments ?
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Julian Roslanowski
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Re: How is this made?
Reply #14 - May 12th, 2016 at 3:15pm
 
Ed, I understand the process you described but I think the biggest challenge would be to cut each segment to ensure each notch within each segment is uniform (centered).
Bruce; the grain direction in the photo I posted runs circular. The joints between the light and dark pieces are end grain to end grain.
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Re: How is this made?
Reply #15 - May 12th, 2016 at 3:37pm
 
Julian Roslanowski wrote on May 12th, 2016 at 3:15pm:
I think the biggest challenge would be to cut each segment to ensure each notch within each segment is uniform (centered)


Make a jig with a triangle piece laying flat with the point up. Then you can place the segment upside down over the point securing it in place to cut the miter. (think box joint jig)This would need to be done for both sides. once tuned up, it would be easy to cut multiple segments easily.
That was just one way I was thinking of, I would have to actually attempt to build this feature to satisfy myself with how I would do it.
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Re: How is this made?
Reply #16 - May 14th, 2016 at 2:20pm
 
You can use the wedgie sled to do it all it is that versital.  I have two, one for vertical cuts and for compound cuts.
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Ed Weber
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Re: How is this made?
Reply #17 - May 14th, 2016 at 4:52pm
 
Walt wrote on May 14th, 2016 at 2:20pm:
You can use the wedgie sled to do it all it is that versital.  I have two, one for vertical cuts and for compound cuts


Walt, are you saying you would use the wedgie sled for cutting the v notch in the center of each segment?
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Bruce Kamp
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Re: How is this made?
Reply #18 - May 15th, 2016 at 11:12am
 
I think I could see how one could use the Segmented Project Planner to get the angles for both the dark and light pieces. I think you would set the incline angle so that the compound segments lie flat. Then, wouldn't the dark pieces be cut at the miter angle defined?
The outside of the ring could then be either side grain or end grain.
I haven't tried this but it seems to make sense.
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Re: How is this made?
Reply #19 - May 15th, 2016 at 11:17am
 
Also, I haven't figured out how to use the wedgie sled to do the compound miters yet. I asked Bill  Kandler and he could not tell me. Has anyone figured it out?
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Julian Roslanowski
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Re: How is this made?
Reply #20 - May 15th, 2016 at 7:39pm
 
Bruce, In Jerry Bennett's last video he explains how to do this.  The compound miter angle is achieved by tilting the saw blade.  You cut half the segments on the 'primary" fence and the other half of the segments on the "complementary" fence.  Then you measure the gap between the primary and complementary pieces to cut the triangles. The end result is a ring with triangular pieces.

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Re: How is this made?
Reply #21 - May 16th, 2016 at 8:25am
 

The piece in the OP has "standard" brick-lay segments, nothing complicated. The only question is/was how to go about cutting the V shaped notch in the segments. This is pretty much the key to the "look" of this piece
This can be done in any number of ways, of which we discussed a few.

If I understand the method you are currently discussing, (making a ring with triangles with the wedgie sled) this is not the same as the original piece. In some circumstances it may have some similarities bit not at all be the same or have the same look. There is a reason this piece stands out, and a lot of it has to do with the construction technique being incorporated into the design. If you change any aspect of this (where the joints are) you will invariably change the look.

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Re: How is this made?
Reply #22 - May 16th, 2016 at 11:54am
 
Ed, I don't see a problem with changing the construction technique.  I believe the end result will be similar and there will be a slightly different look but that doesn't mean it would not be visually appealing. My goal is to try and make the construction easier and achieve a similar look.  I don't want to make a duplicate of someone else's work.  This will be added to my list of "turnings to make". Smiley
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Re: How is this made?
Reply #23 - May 16th, 2016 at 1:49pm
 
Julian Roslanowski wrote on May 16th, 2016 at 11:54am:
Ed, I don't see a problem with changing the construction technique.  I believe the end result will be similar and there will be a slightly different look but that doesn't mean it would not be visually appealing.


How you want to build it is up to you, whether it looks good, well you'll know when you're complete  I wasn't saying it wouldn't look good, just different.
I was just sharing a word of caution.
Not everyone is aware that wood species,  grain direction, even chatoyance are all an integral part of this pieces appeal, along with construction. If constructed differently, (joints in different place) even using the same wood species,  it may not have the same look.

I'm all for you building your own version, go for it.
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