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Update: Different methods of drying green wood (Read 212 times)
 
Luke Owens
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Update: Different methods of drying green wood
Nov 3rd, 2017 at 1:50pm
 
Different methods of drying wood
Luke Owens Per:4

Overview: My science independent project is the different methods of drying wet turned bowls on the lathe and how those bowls react according to the method used to dry the wood. My dependent variable will be 5 types of woods local to the Marin area (still trying to figure out what types), my lathe and my lathe speed, my tools,  my area used to dry the bowls, and the bowl wall thickness is 1 ½ “. My independent variable will be the different methods of drying the bowls turned. I record the progress with pictures and measurements of width, length, depth, and weight.

Materials for Science Experiment
Lathe
Bowl Gouge
Skew Chisel
Chainsaw
Bandsaw
Anchor Seal
Denatured Alcohol
Paper Bag
Scale
Ruler
3 Wood types
Drying room
Computer
Spreadsheet
Camera
Computer
Moisture meter
Microwave
Big pot for boiling bowls

Procedure: So as we know my experiment is to turn bowls on the lathe from wet wood and use different methods of drying the wood to see if it affects how fast it dries, how it warps, and any other movements within the wood. I will conduct my experiment by using 5 types of wood local to the Mill valley area. I will then take the logs and process them into smaller pieces called blanks. I will then take these blanks to the woodshop to process into bowl blanks. Once I have the bowl blanks ready I will seal them with anchor seal so they retain their moisture until I can get them mounted on my lathe.  Before on the lathe I will check the blanks moisture content and write it down. After that i’ll put it on my lathe I will turn them into bowls with a 1 “ wall thickness. Next, I will then take however many bowl i get from that species of tree and do 5 bowls for every drying process. Examples like denatured alcohol drying, microwave drying, paper bag drying with shavings, anchor seal,  and boiling the bowls. The procedure for the denatured alchohol is to soak the bowl in it for 2 hours then let dry on a drying rack. For all of these bowls I will be measuring moisture content with a moisture meter and also taking pictures of how the wood moves. My next method is microwave which is pretty self explanatory. I will do intervals of putting the bowl in the microwave for one minute. For the paper bag drying method i’m going put the green bowls into paper bags with the wet shavings produced from turning the bowl. Next is anchor seal which is a wax emulsion sealer so I will paint that on the end grain of the bowl. Lastly is boiling the bowl which will be done by boiling the bowl on a simmer for 1 hour for every inch of bowl thickness. After these procedure are done I will mark the bowl with the date and a number and I will weigh the bowl to get a starting weight. I will also take pictures to document the movement in the wood. I will post the weight height and moisture content of each bowl on a google spreadsheet and I will mark moisture content and weight every 4 weeks. This will continue until the bowls reach below 10% moisture content.
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« Last Edit: Nov 3rd, 2017 at 1:53pm by Luke Owens »  
 
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Ralph Fahringer
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Re: Update: Different methods of drying green wood
Reply #1 - Nov 3rd, 2017 at 3:42pm
 
Just to keep you on the right path in your experiment:

Is the wall thickness going to 1" or 1 1/2"?
Will you be working with 3 OR 5 wood types?

I ask because you have posted both of these so you might want to correct that.


My suggestion for photographing is to have a graphed cutting board underneath the bowl as you shoot from straight overhead... placing the bowl in the same place everytime so each photo will show how much it has warped in which axis.
You can place a small card in the bowl with the date and time of the shoot.

I would mark the change in weight and moisture content way more frequently than every 4 weeks as I found a bowl i was weighing as I dried it in a brown paper bag with shavings changed weight quite quickly in the first week alone.

Better to show the changes over time and then create a graph of the change so one could see the line slope down quickly at first and then much more slowly as the weeks go on.

Look forward to seeing the results all graphed out for all to see. Thumbs Up Thumbs Up

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Ed Weber
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Re: Update: Different methods of drying green wood
Reply #2 - Nov 4th, 2017 at 12:26pm
 
Ralph Fahringer wrote on Nov 3rd, 2017 at 3:42pm:
Is the wall thickness going to 1" or 1 1/2"?
Will you be working with 3 OR 5 wood types?

I noticed that as well.

Ralph Fahringer wrote on Nov 3rd, 2017 at 3:42pm:
My suggestion for photographing is to have a graphed cutting board underneath the bowl as you shoot from straight overhead

A forensic square or scale would be helpful.

I again agree with Ralph, some wood my shed the majority of it's excess moisture in the first few weeks compared to others, I would say weekly measurements. The more data points, the better.
Luke Owens wrote on Nov 3rd, 2017 at 1:50pm:
Next is anchor seal which is a wax emulsion sealer so I will paint that on the end grain of the bowl

There are two different types of Anchor seal, Classic and 2, Hybrid. Multimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!!  You need to Login or Register

Once a bowl is rough turned it is almost impossible to coat only the end grain, as it wraps around the sides. IMO you'd be better off coating the entire bowl with the same amount of product for each one, xx ounces. Keep things as consistent as possible or your results will have less legitimacy.

I would add some type of instrument to measure relative humidity ( a psychrometer or a  hygrometer) to the tool list to indicate the ambient moisture level of the testing room.
Hope his helps
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robo_hippy
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Re: Update: Different methods of drying green wood
Reply #3 - Nov 5th, 2017 at 12:20am
 
You need a scale as well to weigh moisture loss. Also, on all bowl blanks, round over the rims. Keeping the walls an even thickness is a key to evening out stresses. So, what do you do when you get to the rim and there is no more wall?? By rounding over the rim, this helps even things out. The square edge is sharp and thin. It will slice you to the bone if you are not very careful, and the thin edge will have a much different drying rate and want to crack.

Maple and walnut are fairly stable. Gum is not. Ash is stable. Some fruits like apple are fairly easy to dry, but cherry is not. There is a difference in how woods dry depending on the season they are harvested. With Pacific Madrone, I get far less cracking if I get them when the spring sap is fully rising, like late February or March. Late summer trees crack far more.

Have fun, I will be interested in hearing about results.

robo hippy
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Bill Neff
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Re: Update: Different methods of drying green wood
Reply #4 - Nov 5th, 2017 at 10:28am
 
I think to be able to conduct a real comparison, you should subject one type of wood to all different drying variables.  Run pieces of maple (ideally from the same tree) through all the tests. not maple with one method, walnut with another and apple with yet a different one.  Since each type of wood could react differently to different drying methods, all you'll find out is how one type of wood acts with that particular drying method.

If I've misread or misunderstood what you're doing my apologies.
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Re: Update: Different methods of drying green wood
Reply #5 - Nov 5th, 2017 at 10:46am
 
Usually in a good experiment there is the do nothing option.  So you should just turn one of each species and just set on the shelf to dry and record the results.  If you said it I missed it but all the trees need to be cut at about the same time.  Also all the bowls need to be about the same size.  Getting this experiment set up properly looks like a lot of work in a short period of time
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Luke Owens
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Re: Update: Different methods of drying green wood
Reply #6 - Nov 5th, 2017 at 4:26pm
 
To clarify the questions above I will turn the bowls to 1 " thickness. As for wood types it will be 3 types. Im thinking oak(still not sure what kind) walnut(also not sure what kind) my last wood type I still don't know. Its hard because when i salvage wood it could really be any type. As for the anchorseal thing, I will be sealing the whole bowl in type II anchorseal. Lastly to keep this experiment as accurate as possible i'm going to put a hygrometer inside my drying room which is just a big room with our heater for the house. Thanks everyone for all the support as this experiment needs to be very thorough so all the input really helps.
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