Woodturner's Resource
Woodturner's Resource  
  ē Featured Artist    ē Websites   Support Wr
Tutorials, Projects & Tips   ē Event Calendar   ē Tool and Book Store
  Home Page Forum HelpSearch Map TPT Resources LoginRegister
 
Pages: 1 2 
Send Topic Print
Rainforest angle (Read 528 times)
 
Ben Goeller
Active Member
***
Offline


WR Rocks!

Posts: 229

Rainforest angle
Oct 19th, 2018 at 11:33am
 
The technique used to create this basket illusion is almost completely different than the standard  technique.  This basket illusion is segmented, using maple. Not sure if itís common to segment or not but I havenít seen too many done this way.

I wanted the outline of the beads to be darker than could be achieved using traditional methods (wire and pyro tool) so I used black paint instead. Because the vertical lines were made using a 300,000 rpm air tool (which does leave burn marks) and these lines are ďintoĒ the vessel not laying on the surface, it allowed me to airbrush the vessel black to get the look I wanted.  I watered the paint down so it would get deep into the small vertical grooves without a buildup of paint. Then I sanded the black paint off the surface so it wouldnít affect the color of the final design. It did flatten the beads a little, but in all, I donít think that detracted from the final look. Using this technique made the outline of each bead pure black which I think looks great. I included a close up picture so you can see what I mean.

The final  design was then applied using acrylic paint, not markers. I maintained the horizontal bead lines by applying the paint  low on each bead. Leaving only the black between the beads that would match the vertical lines.

This piece stands 13 inches tall and is 13 inches wide. It has over 37,000 beads. I did make a short movie of the ďmakingĒ of this piece if you are interested. While most of the movie is standard stuff, the use of the 300,000 air tool might be of interest to some of you. Itís at about 2:50 in the movie, the rest is pretty normal.
Multimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!!  You need to Login or Register
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
Ed Weber
WR Administrator
WR Patron
*****
Offline



Posts: 6,222

Wilton, California, USA
Wilton
California
USA

Gender: male

JET 1642
Grizzly G0584
Re: Rainforest angle
Reply #1 - Oct 19th, 2018 at 12:01pm
 
Ben Goeller wrote on Oct 19th, 2018 at 11:33am:
This basket illusion is segmented, using maple. Not sure if itís common to segment or not but I havenít seen too many done this way.


I don't want to get into a battle of semantics but I'm a bit fuzzy.
The shape of the vessel was constructed by segmenting
The basket "illusion" is created by several embellishment methods.
When I hear segmented and basket illusion in the same sentence or discussion, I think of something like this.
Multimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!!  You need to Login or Register

Nice piece but as I have to remind members, it should be posted in the gallery
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
Ralph Fahringer
WR Addict
*****
Offline


I'm the "Burly" Man!!

Posts: 1,064

Ellsworth, Maine, USA
Ellsworth
Maine
USA

Gender: male

PM3520b
Re: Rainforest angle
Reply #2 - Oct 19th, 2018 at 12:28pm
 
Ed..

I think it should be ok for them to post here  and THEN move the images over to the gallery....mainly because I doubt many people go to the gallery every day to see what new stuff is in there.

Personally, I come here everyday and every once in a while i have a peek over at the gallery.

Also, if it was posted over there, then we wouldn't be able to have a discussion about the piece or how it was done and isn't that what this department (?) is about?

As usual, just my 2Ę. Smiley
Back to top
  

Originality is the art of concealing your source.
 
IP Logged
 
Ben Goeller
Active Member
***
Offline


WR Rocks!

Posts: 229

Re: Rainforest angle
Reply #3 - Oct 19th, 2018 at 1:11pm
 
Ed Weber wrote on Oct 19th, 2018 at 12:01pm:
Nice piece but as I have to remind members, it should be posted in the gallery

Ed,
Not sure what the problem is. What I have pictured here is and embellished turning, and I am explaining my technique. This platform is called "Embellished Turnings and Techniques".

I have posted here many times and gotten good questions and responses as to how the basket illusions are made.

A number of years ago I tried to post similar workings in non segmenting forum. WHY because they have NOTHING to do with segmenting!!! You insisted that they be moved and of course NO ONE got to see how the basket illusions were being made because they were NOT looking into the segmenting forum!!

I stopped posting and pretty much left this web site because there was no sense spending my time posting my stuff in the WRONG forum. Then to my surprise you opened the "Embellished Turnings and Techniques" forum and I became interested again in posting my work. Now you tell me that is is not the CORRECT forum. Ok what forum do you think is correct for basket illusions!!! I would love to know. WHY, because I see very little of it being posted on this site yet there seems to be an interest.


Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
Al Wasser
WR Addict
*****
Offline


WR Rocks!

Posts: 542

Pueblo West, CO, Colorado, USA
Pueblo West, CO
Colorado
USA

Gender: male

Robust American Beauty
Re: Rainforest angle
Reply #4 - Oct 19th, 2018 at 1:22pm
 
Ed, I think you need to back off posting completed stuff in the gallery.  It something is posted in the gallery there is no chance to discuss the item, ask questions, etc.  In fact in my opinion you are kicking a large part of the value of this forum out the door.  Let me see, how do you spell losing members?
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
Alistair Hancox
Junior Member
*
Offline



Posts: 29

Madison, Wisconsin, USA
Madison
Wisconsin
USA

Gender: male

Nova Galaxi
Re: Rainforest angle
Reply #5 - Oct 19th, 2018 at 2:40pm
 
Ed,
I've got to agree with everyone else here. I too post finished work here on the forum. There are just a lot of problems with the gallery. It's actually quite difficult to navigate. The forum is so much easier to have a discussion about someone's work, as Ralph and Ben have said.

If the benefit of the gallery is that you can search for someone's finished work, then perhaps that's a function needed for photos posted on the forum.
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
Ed Weber
WR Administrator
WR Patron
*****
Offline



Posts: 6,222

Wilton, California, USA
Wilton
California
USA

Gender: male

JET 1642
Grizzly G0584
Re: Rainforest angle
Reply #6 - Oct 19th, 2018 at 6:12pm
 
I did not make the policy.
I will pass on your concerns, maybe it's time for a change.
There is, or at least there was, valid reasons for posting finished pieces in the gallery.
One is that they stay there permanently and two is that you can search by photo.

As far as the proper forum goes, we ask that you try to post in the most logical place but we will move the thread if necessary.
It's not my intention to make you guys angry and I don't get paid for my time here so take it easy.
Don't shoot the messenger

Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
Ed Weber
WR Administrator
WR Patron
*****
Offline



Posts: 6,222

Wilton, California, USA
Wilton
California
USA

Gender: male

JET 1642
Grizzly G0584
Re: Rainforest angle
Reply #7 - Oct 19th, 2018 at 7:27pm
 
Now that I'm almost done licking my wounds  Roll Eyes

Ben, I think you misunderstood my question/comment.
It had nothing at all to do with the forum you posted in. but this line in your description.
Ben Goeller wrote on Oct 19th, 2018 at 11:33am:
The technique used to create this basket illusion is almost completely different than the standard  technique.  This basket illusion is segmented, using maple. Not sure if itís common to segment or not but I havenít seen too many done this way.


All I was saying was that the vessel is constructed using basic segmenting techniques for size and stability and the illusion part is created by pryography, paint, etc.
That was it.

Please keep in mind that I didn't delete you posts or photos you do anything other than simply ask a simple question.

If there are things any of you want to see changed you can always ask before you feel the need to gang up and tell me how you think the board should be run. We are always open to new ideas.

Ralph Fahringer wrote on Oct 19th, 2018 at 12:28pm:
I think it should be ok for them to post here  and THEN move the images over to the gallery.


Who gets to do this, me?

A heads up on QOTW
What item about the forum would you like to see new or changed?
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
Ben Goeller
Active Member
***
Offline


WR Rocks!

Posts: 229

Re: Rainforest angle
Reply #8 - Oct 20th, 2018 at 5:56am
 
Ed,
First off I didnít suggest that you were trying to move THIS post. What I was referring to was a number of years ago I first started making basket illusions. When I had questions or wanted to show what I had made I posted my work in the regular forum. On of the members asked a question about how I made the shape and I responded that it was segmented. When you or some other administrator saw this it was moved into the segmented forum. From that point on you would not allow me to post a piece that had NOTHING to do with segmenting in any other forum. Stating RULES ARE RULES. So I stopped posting.
Forward to now. This last year I noticed you began a new forum ďEmbellished Turnings and Techniques- project featured here have been turned on a lathe and clearly visible that a lathe was used in the process. A narrative of the process will be appreciated but not necessarily required.
OK, in that I donít see ANYTHING  that sayís why this argument is happening. What rule are you talking about. And if there is a rule why is it not posted for those of us that have only recently come back.

NOW that being said I want to claim my time and stand on my soapbox and question why this argument is even coming up and what is wrong with this posting. Years ago I loved this site, I learned so much from the helpful people that came here. I didnít know squat about turning and was trying to make (and very badly I might add) what would turn out to be basket illusions. I asked many questions and ALWAYS got answers. I stopped using the site because of RULES and was no longer getting feedback that I needed, or seeing pieces or posts that went the direction my passion was taking me.
In the last year I notice this new forum and decided that maybe it was time to rejoin the great people that once helped me so much. In the three years my work has improved , to the point that I have had two artist showings at a gallery in Cleveland in the last  year. One I shared with another artist the second was solely my work. I thought that members of this site might be interested in seeing and asking questions about the making of these pieces.  The new techniques that I have used, the process I incorporated. And here we are, three years later, not one post about the technique of the making of this piece but RULES are RULES, this must be posted elsewhere, where no one will look ,or ask questions, or offer advice.

Iím not trying to be difficult. I just wanted to post something, tell how it was made and get and ask questions. Thatís all.
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
Ron Carrabotta
Senior Member
****
Offline


WR Rocks!

Posts: 422

Dawsonville, ga, Georgia, USA
Dawsonville, ga
Georgia
USA

Gender: male

Jet 1014 VS
Jet 1642 -2EVS
Powermatic 3520B
Re: Rainforest angle
Reply #9 - Oct 20th, 2018 at 7:44am
 
Ed,

I agree with Al, Alistair, Ralph et al., I very seldom look at the Gallery, and I look at this site daily.

As far as Ben's "Segmented/Basket Illusion", I do a lot of BIs and it is hard to find a large single piece of suitable wood to make BIs. The logical step is to build up a segmented piece and then do the BI. Ben's piece is primarily a Basket Illusion, there is no apparent "segmenting" visible.

A segmented piece, meant to "show off" the segmenting process is a horse of a different color. IMHO.

By the way Ben,  great piece, and I'm going to try your technique on my next BI.

Thumbs Up Thumbs Up

Back to top
  

It is easier to be forgiven than to get permission!
 
IP Logged
 
Ralph Fahringer
WR Addict
*****
Offline


I'm the "Burly" Man!!

Posts: 1,064

Ellsworth, Maine, USA
Ellsworth
Maine
USA

Gender: male

PM3520b
Re: Rainforest angle
Reply #10 - Oct 20th, 2018 at 8:41am
 
Ok... Personally, I would like to read this list of rules. Ed, please know that I do not hold you personally responsible... buuuut... how DO we go about changing these "rules"?

Someone , somewhere decided these rules.  Do we get a vote or is it by kingly rule?


In my business rule #2 is to ignore rule #1 whenever necessary.

Seems this might be one of those times. Smiley
Back to top
  

Originality is the art of concealing your source.
 
IP Logged
 
Bill Neff
WR Addict
*****
Offline


WR Rocks!

Posts: 736

Barronett, Wisconsin, USA
Barronett
Wisconsin
USA

Gender: male
Re: Rainforest angle
Reply #11 - Oct 20th, 2018 at 10:22am
 
Not beating up on anyone, but this is a rule I've only heard of recently.  Like Ralph and others I'm here almost daily, but rarely go to the Gallery unless I'm looking for ideas.  Since you have to have a separate log in, it's inconvenient.

Thanks Ed and the other moderators for your work on helping make the site run.
Back to top
  

Some people are like slinkies... totally worthless but it puts a smile on your face when you push them down the stairs.
WWW  
IP Logged
 
Ed Weber
WR Administrator
WR Patron
*****
Offline



Posts: 6,222

Wilton, California, USA
Wilton
California
USA

Gender: male

JET 1642
Grizzly G0584
Re: Rainforest angle
Reply #12 - Oct 20th, 2018 at 11:34am
 
Ralph Fahringer wrote on Oct 20th, 2018 at 8:41am:
Ok... Personally, I would like to read this list of rules. Ed, please know that I do not hold you personally responsible... buuuut... how DO we go about changing these "rules"?


Ask
Right now we are trying to find a solution, taking into account all of your considerations and the gallery & forum software.
We don't want to have people jump through hoops to post a photo but at the same time we have to deal with the current software.

Ron Carrabotta wrote on Oct 20th, 2018 at 7:44am:
As far as Ben's "Segmented/Basket Illusion", I do a lot of BIs and it is hard to find a large single piece of suitable wood to make BIs. The logical step is to build up a segmented piece and then do the BI. Ben's piece is primarily a Basket Illusion, there is no apparent "segmenting" visible.

A segmented piece, meant to "show off" the segmenting process is a horse of a different color. IMHO.

This is all I was getting at, using the term "segmented" in the description was a bit misleading to me.

This is what I can only guess what started this over reaction IMO
Multimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!!  You need to Login or Register

Walt Nolan wrote
"As a moderator of this board I feel this piece has a few homes it could live in.  It was turned so it could go in the Turning forum.  It has a special finish applied to it so it could go in the Finishing forum.  I am glad that you wisely used segmentation to conserve wood to complete your project.  28 years ago I did the same thing using as cheap a wood I could get to complete my projects.
You response

"I understand why, But- if I was someone new to this site and I wanted to see something a member has posted about "basket illusions" what would I look under. Turning would be my first, maybe finishing section next. Of all the things you mentioned this could be under the very last thing I would look for is segmented turning. Since it does actually "nothing" to do with segmenting other than a way to make the shape.
Just saying I disagree with the decision to put it in segmenting but it's not a big deal and whatever you guys decide I'm with you. "

Walt never told you that you had to put your work anywhere, he actually gave you an option and left it up to you. His only comment about segmenting was that it was a good technique to use.
A giant misunderstanding if you ask me.

Ben, I'm not sure what you are so worked up about.
In response to your posts and other in the past we asked members and started the Embellishment forum. (the system works)
All I did now is post a reminder that finished works should be posted in the gallery.
This has always been the case but not enforced in any way, we simply ask.
As I said, maybe it's time to change some procedures but members need to tell us what they do and don't like or else nothing happens. We are open to reasonable suggestions bu you need to tell us.

What exactly would you like us at WR to do to make your visits better?


Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
Ralph Fahringer
WR Addict
*****
Offline


I'm the "Burly" Man!!

Posts: 1,064

Ellsworth, Maine, USA
Ellsworth
Maine
USA

Gender: male

PM3520b
Re: Rainforest angle
Reply #13 - Oct 20th, 2018 at 11:38am
 
...which brings me to another "rule".

Why DO we have to have a separate login for the Gallery?

Why can't we just go to it once we are logged in  here?

Sounds like it IS do-able but for some reason, someone decided we needed to have a separate login. Shocked

How about once we are logged in here, we just check a box saying we want to also be logged into the Gallery.
Back to top
  

Originality is the art of concealing your source.
 
IP Logged
 
Ben Goeller
Active Member
***
Offline


WR Rocks!

Posts: 229

Re: Rainforest angle
Reply #14 - Oct 20th, 2018 at 2:57pm
 
Ed,
Sorry if this is getting out of hand. You asked what do I,we, want. I get from the number of others that seem to have the same complaint itís pretty simple. We want to be able to take our embellished turning, and post it in the embellished turning forum and have discussion and questions about our embellished turning. Without being asked to move it or donít post your embellished turning in the embellished turning forum. Just because itís finished. How hard is that, why does it have to get so far out of hand.
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
Pages: 1 2 
Send Topic Print